Reporting by Scott Proudfit
Asian theatre is so relatively new to the United States that's it's difficult to talk about its "legends." But Sab Shimono and Alvin Ing certainly qualify. Ing and Shimono were both members of the Broadway cast of the groundbreaking musical "Pacific Overtures" in 1976, the first time an all-Asian cast was ever involved in a show of such magnitude.
Today Asian theatre in America is thriving, and its influence of Asian theatre permeates the major works of avant-garde theatremakers from Anne Bogart to Robert Wilson. In addition, Asian film has entered the mainstream, not only in the obviously influence of the Hong Kong action directors, but also in the dramatic, personal films of directors like Wayne Wang and Ang Lee.
But when Ing and Shimono were starting out, the work available to Asian-American actors was minimal. The two actors met as members of a theatrical project in the late '60s called LaMaMa Chinatown, one of six base companies Ellen Stewart created at her experimental NYC theatre to explore the Grotowski method.
Shimono and Ing went on to successful careers onstage, as well as in film and television. Shimono just wrapped a role in the feature film "The Big Hit" and is also starring in the all-Asian production of "Ghosts and Baggage" at the L.A. Theatre Centre. Ing, meanwhile, is currently recreating his Broadway turn in "Pacific Overtures," East West Players' critically acclaimed production in Downtown L.A.'s Little Tokyo.
These two veterans recently met at Campanile Restaurant to talk about the genesis of "Overtures" and how things have changed for Asian actors in America in the past four decades.
Sab Shimono: My first association with Pacific Overtures was the year before it became a musical. They were considering me for one of the roles. Hal Prince was directing it as a straight play. It was a humongous John Weidman script. Boris Aronson was going to do the set for the straight play, but he suggested to Prince that it would make a better musical. So they canceled the production for the straight play and the next year, Sondheim got involved and the musical came about.
Alvin Ing: I was then president of an organization called Theatre for Asian Pacific American Artists. It was an activist organization. We met with Hal Prince and convinced him not to use Caucasian actors as Asians in the show. Once he heard us out, he went even further and had Asians play all the Caucasian roles in the play--the Admiral and the sailors, etc.--which was really a big first. Even if it was Caucasians telling the history of Japan, we were just grateful that these big, big people of the theatre were doing a show on our behalf.
Sab: I found out later that the story was distorted. The character I played, Manjiro--in Japan, he's a hero. And later I met his family. They said, "Why did you make Manjiro a samurai? He was against the samurai." In Japan, Manjiro is like Columbus is here. So to distort that was a big deal. I think in Japan, probably the credibility was lost, which may have been why the scheduled tour to Japan was canceled.
Alvin: It was still a first in American musical theatre, regardless. And, of course, it's an American musical. It's not made for Japan. The writers' theatrical license exceeded what the Japanese would have liked, but certainly it didn't exceed what the Americans would have cared about--even Japanese Americans. I think most Japanese Americans accept the show for what it is.
The More Things Change
Sab: It's great that we have Asian-American theatre now throughout the country and we have Asian writers. We didn't have that when I was starting out. Their writing has helped me personally with saying who I am. It's also given me the opportunity to play material that has rich Asian characters in it--more than just walk-ons or stereotypes. In that way, as an artist, I've been quite satisfied in my later career. And the roles, some of the roles, have been just as demanding as doing Shakespeare.
Alvin: I think there's been a lot of progress. When I first started in the business, there were so few Asians who were performers or actors, that--believe it or not--I was refused several times The King and I, the only show at that time that I could be in. I played the young juvenile and I was refused because originally it had been done by a Caucasian. And you know in theatre, precedent is all-important. These roles were done by Caucasians originally, so producers and casting people thought nothing of casting another Caucasian in the role, even though, there you were, an Asian, and it was an Asian show. Even Flower Drum Song I was refused a couple times.
Sab: But they wouldn't hesitate to cast you as the atmosphere.
Alvin: Exactly. And that was the big difference. So in those early years, I became a little bitter. Because if I didn't get in The King and I, well, then I didn't work at all. All actors go through hard times. But it was not a pleasant experience. It's tough to be a pioneer.
Sab: And I didn't realize we were pioneers when we were doing it. I thought going to Stella Adler for two years, then studying Shakespeare and all that, that I had my craft down. So when I went out into the world, I thought they'd pick me. I wasn't even thinking about Asian roles. I believed they'd pick me for a Shakespeare play or something like that. I didn't even think about it until I was out there, and it started dawning on me--I had to face the reality of the situation. You'd go to a casting person and they'd say, "Oh, we can't hire you." You'd say, "Why not?" "Well, this is for an industrial. And the American audience can't identify with you." I'd say, "Well, I identify with Roy Rogers."
That blew my mind. But we had nowhere to turn to. We had no advocacy group.
Alvin: That's why we formed the Theatre for Asian Pacific American Artists in New York. And here there was APAA: the Association for Asian Pacific American Artists. Unfortunately, APAA went down the drain about two years ago. But it was an advocacy organization that was quite strong.
Sab: Still today 99.9 percent of the time when I'm up for a role, it's because I'm Asian. What doesn't make sense to me is that the people who are now in charge grew up in the '60s; they should have more awareness. I always thought that kind of awareness would filter in, but in some sense I don't see it. I mean, there are roles for me, but I would like to get a role that just says "Mr. Jones," with no other description. Like with ER--I did an ER, but I played a Japanese doctor from Japan. That's all right, but why can't I just play a doctor?
Also, usually when they write a role for a Japanese person, they write it differently. If they were just writing for a person, the writing would be much deeper and much richer--rather than saying, "Oh this is a role for an Asian, We'll get rid of the 'the's." Forget about that. Write it for a human being. Because as an actor, it's a real challenge to have to learn those lines when they get rid of the "the"s. It's hard because it's not natural.
Alvin: Right. Not for us. Maybe for people from the old country. But it's being written by someone who doesn't even know how they speak to begin with.
Sab: You have to become generic to survive. Asians ask me all the time, "Why do you do stereotypical roles?" It's not that we're doing stereotypical roles. As an actor, you have to find the heart of the person, whether it's stereotypical or not. What comes out stereotypical-sounding is the language that's been written. It sounds generic. Because the Chinese foreigner has different ways of speaking English than the Japanese or Korean foreignor. Certain things are different. But when writers make it generic Asian, then you get this stereotypical sound. My advice for writers who have a part they want an Asian to play is, Don't write it for an Asian, just write it for a human being, and let the actor figure it out.
Alvin: The problem is we don't have enough Asian writers. You need them at the creative end. That's the beginning. If you don't have them at the creative end, it's always going to be somewhat stereotypical. But it's getting better. BS